"There's been a lot of talk recently about the exact definition of "torture." Some say it's an accurate descriptor of what happened to Iraqi detainees in U.S. custody. Others say those detainees were not tortured, but simply "abused," and that "torture" is something out of Saddam's dungeons. In a Newsday op-ed this week, linguist Geoffrey Nunberg mused over the invocation of the word "torture". He joins Bob to discuss the political uses and abuses of language, and his new book, Going Nucular: Language, Politics and Culture in Confrontational Times."


- bill 5-23-2004 6:46 pm

chris matthews just said that even he actually felt some shame as an american over the torture in iraq. that is not easy to do. taking fallujah might be easier than making matthews admit to shameful thoughts outside of his yearly confessional.
- dave 5-23-2004 7:40 pm [add a comment]


From the Sontag article Dave posted:

Words alter, words add, words subtract. It was the strenuous avoidance of the word ''genocide'' while some 800,000 Tutsis in Rwanda were being slaughtered, over a few weeks' time, by their Hutu neighbors 10 years ago that indicated the American government had no intention of doing anything. To refuse to call what took place in Abu Ghraib -- and what has taken place elsewhere in Iraq and in Afghanistan and at Guantanamo Bay -- by its true name, torture, is as outrageous as the refusal to call the Rwandan genocide a genocide. Here is one of the definitions of torture contained in a convention to which the United States is a signatory: '' any act by which severe pain or suffering, whether physical or mental, is intentionally inflicted on a person for such purposes as obtaining from him or a third person information or a confession. '' (The definition comes from the 1984 Convention Against Torture and Other Cruel, Inhuman or Degrading Treatment or Punishment. Similar definitions have existed for some time in customary law and in treaties, starting with Article 3 -- common to the four Geneva conventions of 1949 -- and many recent human rights conventions.) The 1984 convention declares, '' No exceptional circumstances whatsoever, whether a state of war or a threat of war, internal political instability or any other public emergency, may be invoked as a justification of torture. '' And all covenants on torture specify that it includes treatment intended to humiliate the victim, like leaving prisoners naked in cells and corridors.

And as far as Skull & Bones hazing, do these victims by virtue of their ordeal gain entrée to an Ol’ Boy network of lucrative connections?

- alex 5-24-2004 4:06 am [add a comment]





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